2007-07-15/log
From FreeCulture.org Wiki
Log for 2007-07-15 meeting
Log
21:03:44 <skyfaller> well, it's about time for the meeting to start, but I'm not seeing several people whom I am expecting, so I guess we'll wait a bit
21:03:53 <gavinbaker> poningru: thx for info
21:03:57 * hj (n=hj@189.152.136.238) has joined #freeculture
21:04:03 <gavinbaker> poningru: doing 2 mtgs at once? ;)
21:04:17 <paulproteus> Well, hey now everybody now.
21:04:26 <poningru> :p
21:04:34 <contra> hello
21:04:38 * hj_ (n=hj@189.152.136.238) has joined #freeculture
21:04:40 <skyfaller> it is really sad that jibot is not with us....
21:04:49 <skyfaller> hj_: having connection troubles?
21:04:52 * bcb2114 (n=brendan@c-69-180-189-36.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) has joined #freeculture
21:05:01 * hj (n=hj@189.152.136.238) has left #freeculture
21:05:02 <skyfaller> maybe we should consider getting our own IRC bot
21:05:06 <poningru> ...
21:05:06 <bcb2114> hey, brendan ballou here
21:05:09 <skyfaller> howdy :)
21:05:15 <paulproteus> Hey Brendan.
21:05:16 <poningru> hi brendan
21:05:17 <hj_> ok sorry im here hello wberyone, have we started yet ?
21:05:20 <paulproteus> skyfaller, Yeah, maybe.
21:05:23 <contra> I thought Nelson was the IRC bot
21:05:48 * skyfaller makes obscure reference to Basshunter, no one gets it
21:06:10 <poningru> basshunter?
21:06:13 <skyfaller> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boten_Anna
21:06:29 <skyfaller> let's give people another 5-10 minutes to arrive
21:06:33 <paulproteus> skyfaller, I'd get it!
21:06:50 <paulproteus> skyfaller, If you have a sec, say what you think of https://bugs.launchpad.net/web/+bug/102351
21:07:02 * gavinbaker gets it
21:07:12 <skyfaller> I feel like I should find a way for people to entertain themselves / each other while we're waiting for the meeting to start
21:07:24 <skyfaller> but sure, I'll go look at that bug paulproteus
21:07:30 <gavinbaker> we could do some lame meeting-warm up
21:07:39 <gavinbaker> like, "everybody say one embarassing thing about themselves"
21:07:40 <conley> oooh, we can do an ice-breaker
21:07:42 <paulproteus> Quick, everyone play online Connect-4!
21:07:48 <conley> let's play mafia!
21:08:06 <gavinbaker> i think the best ice-breaker would be, "everybody start by taking a shot," but there are kids here.
21:08:07 <pyrak> i know a few sweet improv games, none of which will work on irc :(
21:08:12 <skyfaller> Hi, I'm Nelson Pavlosky, and I'm responsible for starting this horrible mistake of an organization that we're all participating in. I think that's pretty embarrassing ;-)
21:08:37 <poningru> nile's here
21:08:42 <poningru> he will join in just a sec
21:08:55 <skyfaller> ok
21:09:16 <skyfaller> I mean, the obvious thing to do would be to state our name and school
21:09:19 * paulproteus wonders if we'll get any Bostoners
21:09:29 <skyfaller> or I could state it for people, since I know everyone ;-)
21:10:17 <skyfaller> So I'm Nelson, formerly from Swarthmore College, and now preparing to attend my first year at George Mason Law
21:10:33 <paulproteus> I'm Asheesh, Master of the Web Team and other Fine Technical Arts.
21:10:34 <erin> I'm Erin, from Stanford
21:10:36 <conley> My name is Conley Owens. I'm a rising grad student studying CS (Artificial Intelligence and Bioinformatics) at Virginia Tech. I have a degree in CS and a degree in math from the same university.
21:10:46 * mecredis (n=fred@cpe-74-73-135-105.nyc.res.rr.com) has joined #freeculture
21:10:47 <Fear_of_C> I'm Nick, currently at Swarthmore
21:10:50 <paulproteus> Sweet, hi mecredis.
21:10:54 <mecredis> yzzha
21:10:59 <poningru> yarr
21:11:01 <gavinbaker> oh wow, this works asynchronusly!
21:11:08 <nile> okay! I'm here!
21:11:21 <mecredis> so yeah
21:11:21 <paulproteus> It can be that easy if you skip the collision-avoidance protocol.
21:11:26 * nile reads scrollback
21:11:36 <poningru> paulproteus: no wai
21:11:42 <hj_> Hi im hj (hector jaime) from Monterrey Tech, and its been two months since i last payed for information
21:11:43 <pyrak> i'm parker, i'm from chadwick (a k-12 in southern california)
21:11:59 <conley> hj_: awesome
21:12:10 <gavinbaker> I'm Gavin, recent graduate from the University of Florida currently working for SPARC
21:12:13 <poningru> Hi I'm Eldo Varghese and cleaning his room
21:12:21 <BrianRowe> Hello I am Brian Rowe a second year law student at Seattle University..One embaressing thing... I worked for Mircosoft before returning to law school. I currently run an orginization called Freedom for IP that works to elimate IP when it gets in the way of human rights
21:12:22 <skyfaller> hj_ = our first Mexican chapter, give him props
21:12:23 <gavinbaker> poningru: i don't believe that last half.
21:12:24 <mecredis> ?whois Mecredis
21:12:30 <gavinbaker> mecredis: jibot's awol
21:12:32 <poningru> no totally its true
21:12:42 <mecredis> tis a pity
21:12:48 <mecredis> Fred from NYC / NYU
21:12:50 <paulproteus> I'm also formerly a student (but never started a chapter) at Johns Hopkins University, and I'm also a software engineer now at Creative Commons.
21:12:52 <poningru> BrianRowe: ooh nice
21:13:00 <poningru> you also have an embarrasing last name ;p
21:13:13 <gavinbaker> hj_: mucho gusto, bienvenidos !
21:13:31 <tvol> timothy--grad student in school of information at university of michigan and creative commons intern this summer
21:13:32 <bcb2114> brendan ballou, columbia in new york
21:13:33 <paulproteus> skyfaller, is hj_ the guy I Skyped with around April 2005?
21:13:36 <paulproteus> Oh, hey tvol!
21:13:37 <mecredis> bcb2114, whas up
21:13:37 <pyrak> skyfaller, basshunter ftw
21:13:42 <erin> i think i may be alone in saying i'm doing an undergrad in studio art
21:13:44 <skyfaller> paulproteus: almost certainly not
21:13:52 <tvol> hey paulproteus!
21:13:54 <paulproteus> skyfaller, Shucks.
21:13:54 <mecredis> erin, awesome, where?
21:13:57 <tvol> didn't i just see you?
21:14:01 <erin> at stanford
21:14:03 <paulproteus> erin, Thank good, we need more of you!
21:14:11 <paulproteus> goodness, that is.
21:14:14 <bcb2114> hey fred - I'm in nyc next week for a columbia fc meeting - are you around?
21:14:18 <mecredis> bcb2114, indeed
21:14:18 <skyfaller> good is thankable too, I think
21:14:25 <erin> i also think i may be the only girl so yes, you do :)
21:14:31 <conley> btw: skyfaller: I realized I don't have any money, so I won't be dancing tonight
21:14:38 <poningru> erin: not true
21:14:39 <skyfaller> erin: there are a number of other females in FC.o, they're just not here right now
21:14:44 <contra> you don't need money to dance
21:14:50 <erin> ok good
21:15:02 <contra> even the fascists can't ban dancing
21:15:17 <poningru> our female:male is much higher than the normal free software movement female:male
21:15:18 * pyrak is probably the lowerclassman of the group :/
21:15:26 <gavinbaker> contra: but the quakers can!
21:15:28 <conley> contra: If I want to dance with the live band down the street, I have to pay
21:15:29 <gavinbaker> also the shakers
21:15:36 <skyfaller> the shakers didn't ban dancing
21:15:42 <skyfaller> they just danced very strangely
21:15:43 <poningru> shakers shake but the quakers dont quake
21:15:44 <contra> Quakers just dance without music
21:15:46 <gavinbaker> didn't they? they banned sex
21:15:51 <mecredis> what about dice rolling?
21:15:52 <poningru> pwnt
21:15:53 <contra> there are actually two shakers still alive
21:15:55 <nile> for certain values of "sex"
21:15:55 <contra> they're very old
21:16:00 <skyfaller> .... and we are OFF TOPIC
21:16:07 <contra> did the meeting start?
21:16:12 <hj_> So, what the agenda for the meeting ?
21:16:13 <mecredis> who's on first?
21:16:16 <paulproteus> I didn't see a gavel.
21:16:16 <skyfaller> contra: yes, we're introducing ourselves :)
21:16:17 <poningru> contra: I think we are still ice breaker
21:16:18 <mecredis> I only have a bit of time
21:16:21 <skyfaller> GAVEL!
21:16:24 * skyfaller pounds
21:16:26 <nile> meanwhile, I'm Nile of Florida Free Culture and still without major. though I tell people I'm in Digital Arts and Sciences
21:16:28 <contra> how do we go around a circle in IRC?
21:16:28 <poningru> aah not so loud
21:16:31 <contra> alphabetically?
21:16:37 <skyfaller> that would have been logical
21:16:40 <skyfaller> but oh well
21:16:46 <skyfaller> Scudmissile: you here?
21:16:48 <paulproteus> Asynchronous is nice, though.
21:17:02 <contra> I'm Ben. I'm from Swarthmore like the bot says. We're all dancing quakers at Swarthmore
21:17:14 <paulproteus> It's true, I've been there.
21:17:15 <skyfaller> the bot isn't here today, sadly
21:17:23 <bcb2114> yeah, what's first on the agenda?
21:17:31 <skyfaller> the agenda! http://wiki.freeculture.org/2007-07-15
21:17:53 <skyfaller> first item was updating the chapter roster
21:18:09 <skyfaller> I guess I kind of took care of a lot of that today while calling people to remind them of the meeting
21:18:10 <mecredis> trimming the fat
21:19:01 <skyfaller> chapters that no longer exist include University of Oregon
21:19:09 <skyfaller> and Hampshire College
21:19:15 <poningru> :(
21:19:19 <mecredis> we hardly knew ye
21:19:36 <skyfaller> more disturbing are the chapters that still theoretically exist
21:19:40 <skyfaller> but whom I could not reach
21:19:50 <mecredis> zombie chapters
21:19:54 <poningru> how high were they?
21:19:55 <paulproteus> How might they theoretically exist?
21:19:58 <paulproteus> They update blogs, etc.?
21:19:58 * BenK_HMC (n=ben@ip72-200-155-112.ri.ri.cox.net) has joined #freeculture
21:20:02 <pyrak> i'll bring back hampshire if i end up going there :P
21:20:06 <skyfaller> well, their contact graduated, e.g. Emerson
21:20:13 <mecredis> ok
21:20:18 <mecredis> why don't we make a category for them
21:20:19 <nile> paulproteus, by still being on the chapters list, of course. the computer tells me so. it must be true. =)
21:20:27 <skyfaller> yeah, we'll probably want to make categories for our chapters
21:20:30 <mecredis> like "Once Active, Now Possibly Defunct due to Graduation, etc."
21:20:33 <skyfaller> e.g. "Active" and "Inactive"
21:20:42 <skyfaller> which brings me to my next point
21:21:00 <skyfaller> we're in the process of overhauling our chapter database
21:21:12 <skyfaller> paulproteus: any idea of an ETA? how complete is the code?
21:21:30 <paulproteus> skyfaller, I'm afraid I don't have an ETA, but I can try to have one mid this week.
21:21:34 <skyfaller> ok, sounds good
21:21:42 <skyfaller> once the chapters database is overhauled, we're going to have to ask all of our chapters to re-register
21:21:47 <mecredis> hrmmm
21:21:50 <mecredis> ok
21:21:56 <skyfaller> the old database is too crufty
21:21:57 <paulproteus> skyfaller, We don't *have* to, but I think it's a good thing to do.
21:22:01 <skyfaller> full of out of date info
21:22:04 <mecredis> sure
21:22:08 * paulproteus nods, Sure.
21:22:14 <skyfaller> and it'll also help us tell who is active and who isn't
21:22:21 <mecredis> ok ok
21:22:29 <skyfaller> chapters that don't reregister after repeated e-mails, IMs, phone calls etc. can be considered dead
21:22:33 <contra> you'll need to wait until the semester starts
21:22:39 <nile> what about our luddite chapters who don't use the internet? =(
21:22:51 <skyfaller> so that'll help us tell for sure
21:22:57 <contra> and you might be able to get graduating/inactive members to pass the baton to other students at the school
21:22:59 <skyfaller> nile: I'll call them :P
21:23:18 <contra> Fear_of_C: you here?
21:23:20 <poningru> people who dont use internet?
21:23:21 <mecredis> nile, those chapters are even more worrying
21:23:24 <poningru> that doesnt exist
21:23:26 <skyfaller> contra: yeah, that's something we need to formalize more
21:23:27 <Fear_of_C> yep, I'm here
21:23:35 <contra> well hello then
21:23:39 <Fear_of_C> hi
21:23:41 <skyfaller> contra: we need to make sure that's part of running a chapter and finishing your year
21:23:51 <skyfaller> you should hand off officially at the end of the year
21:24:01 <conley> btw: is this meeting restricted to chapter leaders?
21:24:05 <mecredis> most "official" clubs at schools have processes for that
21:24:09 <skyfaller> conley: decidedly not
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun 21:24:15 2007
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun 21:24:23 2007
21:24:24 * Now talking on #freeculture
21:24:24 * Topic for #freeculture is: FreeCulture.org | student movement for free culture | http://freeculture.org/ | Bug tracker: https://launchpad.net/web/+bugs | New Web site just launched, check it out! | Chapters meeting Sunday, 15 July at 9 pm EDT (now) | Agenda/minutes at: http://wiki.freeculture.org/2007-07-15
21:24:24 * Topic for #freeculture set by skyfaller at Sun 21:02:20 2007
21:24:24 -NickServ- Password accepted - you are now recognized
21:24:24 * services. sets mode +e skyfaller
21:24:24 * NickServ set your hostname to "wikipedia/Skyfaller"
21:24:28 <skyfaller> oops, closed the window, sorry
21:24:45 <skyfaller> anyway
21:24:55 * tannewt (n=scott@gentoo/developer/tannewt) has joined #freeculture
21:25:01 <paulproteus> Hey tannewt!
21:25:08 * gavinbaker eats a sandwich & reads scrollback
21:25:16 <nile> gavinbaker, yum
21:25:17 <skyfaller> tannewt: howdy! are you bringing Free Culture to Seattle along with BrianRowe? ;-)
21:25:37 <tannewt> skyfaller, not really, have other things
21:25:48 <skyfaller> well, that's another chapter we can scratch I guess
21:25:51 <skyfaller> moving on!
21:26:02 <nile> Seattle should have a chapter. I mean, it's Seattle!
21:26:05 <nile> oh well
21:26:18 <BrianRowe> We have one chapter
21:26:21 <mecredis> hrm
21:26:26 <erin> Stanford didn't and lessig is here
21:26:31 <erin> you just can't predict
21:26:41 <mecredis> erin, good point
21:26:46 * nile scratches chin
21:27:01 * mllerustad (n=mllerust@c-69-143-179-58.hsd1.va.comcast.net) has joined #freeculture
21:27:01 * chz (n=chz@cpe-024-162-252-149.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #freeculture
21:27:07 <skyfaller> so one thing I wanted from people was to know whether anybody is graduating
21:27:09 <tannewt> skyfaller, of course if the campus is up in arms about the RIAA next fall I might try and kickstart the group
21:27:11 * ma9us (n=limehat@cpe-066-057-241-053.nc.res.rr.com) has joined #freeculture
21:27:13 <skyfaller> and passing on the torch
21:27:20 <conley> chz and ma9us are both my minions
21:27:25 <poningru> lol
21:27:31 <conley> both undergrad CS majors, seniors
21:27:32 <ma9us> Hey
21:27:37 <paulproteus> conley, Good, the world needs more Free Culture Minions.
21:27:37 <poningru> damn I want minions
21:27:39 <skyfaller> I'm guessing that nobody in this channel falls into that category, but feel free to prove me wrong
21:27:43 <skyfaller> hooray for minions
21:27:44 <BrianRowe> we should get one going at UW maybe through thier informatics program or the MLIS program...
21:27:52 <hj_> Im allready out of school, so im looking to "the chosen one" probably it will happen un january
21:28:00 <poningru> BrianRowe: awesome
21:28:31 <hj_> all my team is about to graduate, or graduated... we still need fresh blood
21:28:43 <skyfaller> hj_: literally nobody is left? well, that's interesting
21:28:49 <hj_> i hope with this semesters "big" events we can attract people
21:28:58 <skyfaller> oh, about to graduate
21:29:02 <hj_> well they are, but none of the can take care of the chapter
21:29:09 <hj_> everyone is full of things to do...
21:29:20 <hj_> working, responsabilities with other groups etc...
21:29:22 <gavinbaker> hj_: do you know the cc | mx guys?
21:29:34 <hj_> nope, i believe they are at Mexico city right ?
21:29:40 <gavinbaker> hj_: i think so, not sure
21:29:48 <gavinbaker> they like mezcal, if you throw a party probably they will come
21:29:55 <gavinbaker> mecredis: is that not true?
21:29:55 <hj_> i mean i can keep taking care of the chapter, but it think a student should be in charge
21:30:04 <paulproteus> hj_, Yeah, I know what you mean...
21:30:11 <paulproteus> Not from personal experience but from others'.
21:30:18 <mecredis> gavinbaker, cc mexcio?
21:30:22 <mecredis> huh?
21:30:34 <gavinbaker> you know, leon and his friend. rio... the mezcal...
21:30:38 <paulproteus> mecredis, http://creativecommons.org.mx/
21:30:40 <gavinbaker> </OT>
21:30:42 <paulproteus> Also, the Mezcal.
21:30:54 <pyrak> we should have various degrees of activity, i think just having a semi-active mailing list and occasional exchanging of ideas is "active"
21:30:55 <mecredis> right, but why am I being asked?
21:31:26 <gavinbaker> mecredis: you were in rio
21:31:28 <skyfaller> hj_: well, if you want to hand off the FC contact to a student, if you find someone, just tell us
21:31:39 <skyfaller> so we know to update the chapter contact info etc.
21:31:52 <hj_> ok its still not a problem, but next year ill be running three companies, so i might need help
21:32:16 <mecredis> oh, not sure, my memory is faint re: CC MX
21:32:16 <skyfaller> I also know for instance that Erin Watson from UNC has graduated, and she gave me the name of the new contact Catherine but I haven't had a chance to talk to her yet
21:32:21 <hj_> im sure that by january we will find a great team of fresh blood to take over
21:32:33 <poningru> mecredis: too much alcohol?
21:32:34 * Yaco2 (n=Yaco2@201.255.250.190) has joined #freeculture
21:32:35 <poningru> ;P
21:32:38 <contra> over-organizing cannot make up for lack of enthusiastic members
21:32:38 <skyfaller> we need to have a better process for bringing new chapter members into the national organization
21:32:54 <skyfaller> OK, before we move on to the next subject
21:32:56 <poningru> skyfaller: give them pidgin and point em toward irc?
21:33:02 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: what's the timeline for re-registering?
21:33:05 <poningru> I think a social structure needs to exist
21:33:33 <mecredis> contra, totally with you on that
21:33:35 <skyfaller> Re-registering: we need to get our chapters re-registered before the semester starts
21:33:44 <skyfaller> so that we can be sure that we have up-to-date shipping info if nothing else
21:33:54 <poningru> will the website be ready before then?
21:33:55 <Fear_of_C> we are shipping things at the start of the semester?
21:33:59 <skyfaller> and we can ship care packages to all the chapters as usual
21:34:17 <mecredis> ok guys
21:34:19 <mecredis> I have to split
21:34:23 <poningru> cya
21:34:23 <mecredis> anyone interested in free culture
21:34:25 <mecredis> and running a chapter
21:34:26 <conley> is the stuff you ship free for us (as in free beer)
21:34:27 <skyfaller> poningru: whether or not the new chapters database is ready, we'll have to go ahead... if the new database isn't ready in time, we'll just hand-hack the old database to work for one more semseter
21:34:29 <mecredis> can e-mail me
21:34:34 <mecredis> or if you're in NYC
21:34:36 * nile waves to mecredis
21:34:38 <mecredis> just drop by
21:34:41 <poningru> dont drink too much
21:34:46 <poningru> skyfaller: hmm k
21:34:48 <mecredis> fcb @ fredbenenson.com / 917 862 7819
21:34:48 <mecredis> ciao
21:34:55 <skyfaller> conley: yeah, we'll be shipping you stuff from our friends like EFF, CC, and PK, as well as some of our own stuff hopefully, like t-shirts
21:35:02 <poningru> w00t
21:35:06 <conley> sweet!
21:35:11 * mecredis (n=fred@cpe-74-73-135-105.nyc.res.rr.com) has left #freeculture ("Leaving")
21:35:15 <contra> FreeCulture van that goes campus-to-campus giving out free beer and free software.
21:35:15 <poningru> maybe this time we wont give it all away at the first meeting
21:35:20 * poningru glares at gavinbaker
21:35:24 <gavinbaker> contra: Free Beer, even
21:35:25 <BrianRowe> where do we need to add our mailing adress?
21:35:35 <gavinbaker> poningru: s/first/a year later
21:35:48 <skyfaller> BrianRowe: we'll tell you over the chapters mailing list when the re-registering site is ready
21:35:58 <skyfaller> so this meeting was partially a test of that mailing list :P
21:35:58 <BrianRowe> ok
21:35:59 <contra> the best part is we get Nelson to dress up in an obnoxious outfit and have a megaphone shouting about "opening your source"
21:36:15 <gavinbaker> if the re-registration site isn't ready in 30 days, we're tar-and-fearing skyfaller (and maybe paulproteus too)
21:36:22 <skyfaller> :P thanks, Gavin
21:36:24 <poningru> lol
21:36:34 <skyfaller> and that's about all I have to say about the chapters headcount
21:36:35 <gavinbaker> s/fear/feather
21:36:41 <skyfaller> wait
21:36:46 <gavinbaker> if you want to help get the new database up quicker, talk to paulproteus !
21:36:48 <skyfaller> before we do anything else, can someone take minutes?
21:37:11 <poningru> ‚ÄΩ
21:37:12 <nile> wow. I didn't get anything from the chapters mailing list. I guess I'm not registered for it, after all.
21:37:14 <paulproteus> I nominate contra.
21:37:18 * poningru pastes his logs
21:37:24 <gavinbaker> skyfaller, i'll write up minutes from the logs.
21:37:33 <paulproteus> Sounds good to me.
21:37:44 <contra> ha, if I do minutes I'm not mentioning any of my comments
21:38:03 <nile> <3 gavinbaker
21:38:08 * gavinbaker is mentioning contra's comments
21:38:11 * erinR (i=ab40f482@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-1a6f2f9f84f07a86) has joined #freeculture
21:38:23 <nile> erinR, are you erin ?
21:38:25 <skyfaller> paulproteus: incidentally, if we could get a bot to automatically log the channel, at least during meetings, that would be good
21:38:26 * nile blinks
21:38:27 <erinR> yes
21:38:32 * cameronparkins (n=cameronp@adsl-69-232-233-219.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) has joined #freeculture
21:38:33 <nile> welcome back :)
21:38:35 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: you sure you want this to be public?
21:38:37 <erinR> having weird problems with firefox
21:38:38 <paulproteus> Sweet, hi cameronparkins.
21:38:38 <erinR> thanks
21:38:38 <skyfaller> heh, guess that web portal isn't as reliable as we hoped
21:38:43 <cameronparkins> hey all - sorry im so late
21:38:47 * paulproteus gets all eye-shifty
21:38:48 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: at least during meetings, yes
21:38:55 <skyfaller> well, I guess the log could be private
21:39:06 <skyfaller> but anyway
21:39:08 <poningru> skyfaller: we all log our irc channels
21:39:10 * gavinbaker forgot to include a ;) in his last comment
21:39:24 <poningru> so I can just upload it somewhere
21:39:35 <skyfaller> poningru: yes, but it should be online somewhere where the person taking minutes can get at them... and it shouldn't have to be done manually by you
21:39:37 <pyrak> erinR, so am I! omgtwins!
21:39:41 <skyfaller> but yeah
21:39:44 <skyfaller> moving on!
21:39:54 <skyfaller> so this brings us to how we can help chapters
21:40:01 <contra> I plan on my posthumous reputation being built entirely from IRC logs and witty IM conversations. Oh and facebook profiles.
21:40:03 <skyfaller> see the agenda at http://wiki.freeculture.org/2007-07-15 if you're arriving late
21:40:40 <skyfaller> So as that page says, we can offer various webhosting things
21:40:49 <contra> like a blog eventually? ;-)
21:40:57 <skyfaller> if you have your own hosting somewhere, we can point a subdomain at it
21:41:14 <hj_> we could also have a Wordpress MU setup...
21:41:14 <skyfaller> we currently offer mailing lists and wikis to our chapters
21:41:29 <poningru> hj_: paulproteus is working on that iirc
21:41:33 <skyfaller> hj_: yes, in the near future we also hope to offer blogs
21:41:49 <poningru> err s/paulproteus/web team
21:41:57 <gavinbaker> poningru: lulz
21:42:09 <skyfaller> erinR asked whether we could just give her access to the server so she could install stuff herself, and the answer is a qualified yes!
21:42:24 <conley> can you just give us ftp and a mysql database?
21:42:33 <conley> and we can do our own blog setups?
21:42:45 <skyfaller> conley: we can offer things like that, yes, but let me finish explaining
21:42:52 * barney (i=fimns328@gateway/web/cgi-irc/irc.net/x-8409f4a2ab1cfd2d) has joined #freeculture
21:42:55 <conley> sorry
21:43:03 <gavinbaker> friendly announcement: to follow along in the agenda, read along @ http://wiki.freeculture.org/2007-07-15
21:43:18 <skyfaller> it's a qualified yes because we wanted to avoid having 100 different Wordpress installations, all in various states of decay
21:43:42 <Fear_of_C> also, it might be helpful to standardize things if we are using openID
21:43:58 <skyfaller> what we want to be able to offer is a single installation, which can serve up multiple websites
21:44:06 <skyfaller> we are already doing that with Mediawiki
21:44:18 <skyfaller> we can create a wiki for your chapter in no time at all
21:44:37 <skyfaller> and it is run from a single Mediawiki installation, so that when we update the software, the software for every chapter wiki gets updated at the same time
21:44:39 <gavinbaker> FC.o could, in theory, create little disk "accounts" (partitions) for each chapter to play with
21:44:49 <gavinbaker> but it seems a lot more reasonable to have one install of WordPress than 30
21:44:50 <poningru> or just give them quotas
21:45:07 <gavinbaker> especially because then we can make sure they're all maintained / secure / etc.
21:45:08 <poningru> err I was thinking quotas for ftp
21:45:13 <skyfaller> you also benefit from improvements we make to the Mediawiki install, like updating the anti-spam measures
21:45:21 <pyrak> i think we can compromise between both standardization and having a sandbox to play in
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun 21:45:28 2007
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun 21:45:34 2007
21:45:34 * Now talking on #freeculture
21:45:34 * Topic for #freeculture is: FreeCulture.org | student movement for free culture | http://freeculture.org/ | Bug tracker: https://launchpad.net/web/+bugs | New Web site just launched, check it out! | Chapters meeting Sunday, 15 July at 9 pm EDT (now) | Agenda/minutes at: http://wiki.freeculture.org/2007-07-15
21:45:34 * Topic for #freeculture set by skyfaller at Sun 21:02:20 2007
21:45:36 * poningru rofl
21:45:38 <poningru> s
21:45:46 <skyfaller> I keep closing the @#$%ing window
21:45:53 <Fear_of_C> i also think that most chapters will get bored with playing around at some point, and it will be good to only have to maintain the blogs once
21:46:09 <skyfaller> yeah, I think that it may be more beneficial to have our hackers working on interesting stuff
21:46:14 <skyfaller> instead of installing Wordpress 100 times
21:46:14 <gavinbaker> the status quo is, each chapter can do whatever they want -- they just have to host it themselves
21:46:16 <Fear_of_C> though i like the idea of chopping up the extra space for individual accounts
21:46:25 <gavinbaker> of course anyone is welcome to self-host whatever they want, forever
21:46:33 <Fear_of_C> in case some chapter has some special additions they want to make
21:46:35 * nile nails skyfaller's IRC window to his screen so he stops closing it
21:46:54 <skyfaller> We definitely give people shell accounts on our server, and give them sandboxes to play with. But when they play, I think it would be better for them to play with interesting stuff like Columbia's Tor project instead of the basics
21:46:59 <skyfaller> like a wiki or a blog
21:47:04 <Fear_of_C> agreed
21:47:09 <pyrak> here here
21:47:12 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: i don't see why we should prevent people from playing with the basics, if they want
21:47:19 <gavinbaker> unless there are security / manageability concerns
21:47:22 <gavinbaker> which i think there are
21:47:32 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: well, it's also just a massive duplication of effort
21:47:35 <Fear_of_C> people still could
21:47:41 * mark007 kicks the door in and takes a seat
21:47:42 <Fear_of_C> they just shouldn't have to
21:47:43 <gavinbaker> but to ban it because "we don't want you to waste your time" is pretty nanny state-ish
21:47:52 <skyfaller> and I think it's better for people to be free to work on their chapter instead of having to sweat this boring tech stuff
21:47:55 <skyfaller> we're not goingn to ban it
21:47:56 * gavinbaker hands mark007 a cold cider | welcome, friend
21:47:58 <skyfaller> *going to
21:48:25 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: we already said FC.o would host it if the chapters wanted. the question is, what if the chapter doesn't want
21:48:29 <skyfaller> but we are going to offer these web services and encourage people to contribute to the central code instead of everyone installing their own copies of the same software
21:48:30 * poningru takes the cold cider from mark007
21:48:33 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: then that's fine
21:48:33 <poningru> dude he's below 21
21:48:42 <skyfaller> we'll continue to offer subdomain forwarding as we do today
21:48:46 <mark007> I wasn't going to report it if you weren't...
21:48:56 <poningru> skyfaller gavinbaker: i think we can give them chroot env that wont mess with the rest of the stuff
21:48:57 <paulproteus> Guys, there's not much to say about web hosting; let's move on. The summary is, If you ask for something, you'll get it, perhaps also with a lecture.
21:49:02 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: you seemed to imply that we wouldn't be offering webspace for people to poke around with their own blog, etc. is that accurate?
21:49:12 <gavinbaker> poningru: on the internet, no one knows you're <21
21:49:14 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: no, you missed the point
21:49:17 <poningru> paulproteus++
21:49:28 <poningru> ok guys what paulproteus said
21:49:30 <contra> on the internet, no one knows you're only skimming the IRC backlog
21:49:31 <nile> sersiouly.
21:49:32 * BenK_HMC has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
21:49:42 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: I said that they could but I'd prefer that they didn't spend their time installing a wiki and blog which we could do for them in two seconds
21:49:54 <skyfaller> and instead work on more interesting software projects and creating something new
21:50:03 <skyfaller> but if they want to install their own blog
21:50:06 <skyfaller> nobody will stop them
21:50:08 <pyrak> then we're all on the same page i think
21:50:11 <gavinbaker> skyfaller, for the record that's not what you said, but if that's what you meant, cool. i just wanted to be clear. any other questions?
21:50:25 <poningru> ...
21:50:29 <gavinbaker> p.s. he who takes the minutes writes the record :D
21:50:37 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: you're kind of scary, dude
21:50:40 <skyfaller> ok, moving on
21:50:42 <Fear_of_C> is there a way that we can create wordpress "profiles"?
21:50:54 <Fear_of_C> st. the swarthmore one can say swarthmore, etc.
21:50:59 <Fear_of_C> i assume there is
21:51:03 <poningru> Fear_of_C: yes MU
21:51:05 <skyfaller> Fear_of_C: yes yes
21:51:07 <poningru> and its already done
21:51:21 <skyfaller> Fear_of_C, contra, erinR: if you want to talk webspace, stay after the meeting
21:51:28 <skyfaller> and paulproteus and I and others will help you out
21:51:39 <gavinbaker> conley might be included in that too -- is that right?
21:51:40 <erinR> ok sounds good
21:51:43 <Fear_of_C> ok
21:51:45 <skyfaller> yah
21:51:59 <conley> maybe
21:52:03 <skyfaller> so we also offer shipping of care packages, as mentioned
21:52:16 <conley> I mean yea, I definitly want webspace
21:52:30 <gavinbaker> conley: ok, hang out after then
21:52:35 <skyfaller> conley: you can have whatever kind of webspace you want, ignore the above discussion, we'll talk about it afterwards
21:52:35 <contra> ok
21:53:04 <skyfaller> so there are various issues with the care packages
21:53:17 <skyfaller> we can ship plenty of stuff from friendly organizations as always
21:53:32 <skyfaller> but I think it's important that we be able to offer some of our own stuff
21:53:37 <skyfaller> e.g. pamphlets, t-shirts
21:53:49 <skyfaller> today is not the day to discuss that in detail
21:53:58 <skyfaller> but we will need volunteers to help produce this stuff
21:54:00 <pyrak> shop.freeculture.org!
21:54:10 <pyrak> ;)
21:54:15 <gavinbaker> "Free as in speech, but not as in beer"
21:54:19 <Fear_of_C> what type of production? graphic design, stuffing boxes, etc.?
21:54:20 <skyfaller> pyrak: yeah, we could use your help developing the website end of that actually, but we'll cover that another time
21:54:30 <pyrak> roger roger
21:54:39 <skyfaller> Fear_of_C: all of the above
21:55:03 <skyfaller> ... and gavinbaker is playing OpenQuake
21:55:12 <pyrak> i'll enlist some friends to throw out some graphical ideas
21:55:14 <contra> I think it'd be cooler to give people computer-processable designs and instructions on how to print their own stuff in a nice way
21:55:21 <skyfaller> contra: we can do that too
21:55:28 <pyrak> contra++
21:55:31 <poningru> skyfaller: nile and I have been thinking about trying to make shirts
21:55:37 <contra> I think it's more reasonable, considering we don't have money or people to stuff boxes
21:55:43 <skyfaller> but if you're just starting a new chapter, you may not have an opportunity to duplicate things on a massive scale before you have any other members
21:55:52 <skyfaller> or the budget before you have a club
21:55:59 <contra> hopefully new clubs can still print flyers, etc.
21:56:06 <Fear_of_C> that which can be printed from a standard computer can be sent over the internet, but there's some stuff that's harder
21:56:14 <skyfaller> we want to lower the barrier to entry for people as much as possible
21:56:19 <contra> Fear_of_C: I mean give instructions for how/where to silkscreen t-shirts, etc.
21:56:21 <Fear_of_C> things like posters and t-shirts can be really difficult/expensive for small orgs to get
21:56:23 <skyfaller> the goal is to make it dead easy to start a chapter
21:56:33 <contra> yeah, well FCorg is a small organization
21:56:41 <contra> how can we afford to do this on a large scale?
21:56:45 <Fear_of_C> i mean, SWIL (a club at our school) went through hell trying to print like 3 posters
21:56:50 <skyfaller> contra: we'll get to that later in this meeting
21:56:54 <Fear_of_C> if someone else in the national org can print them cheap
21:57:03 <Fear_of_C> then they should and distribute to the others
21:57:06 <skyfaller> contra: the traditional way is that I spend my personal time to assemble everything in my dorm and ship it to people :P
21:57:15 <contra> Fear_of_C: then that's the kind of thing that can be done with a strong mailing list/horizontal communication.
21:57:16 <pyrak> skyfaller, i read the wiki entry about this so i know the deficult it entails, but i think we still need a bubbly, inviting, graphical explanation of "wtf is free culture"?
21:57:17 <gavinbaker> i feel like FC.o should be "big" enough to print and distribute T-shirts and posters for its chapters. but that's later in the agenda
21:57:20 <contra> it's still going to be decentralized
21:57:49 <skyfaller> contra: we'll return to that in a few minutes
21:57:49 <contra> gavinbaker: I'm not saying it SHOULDN'T be big enough, it just isn't able to do this right now efficiently (e.g., can guarantee I'll get a box of free t-shirts)
21:58:04 <contra> oki
21:58:07 <gavinbaker> contra: it's actually worked pretty well a few times. well, it's worked ok
21:58:13 <skyfaller> the point is that we have done shipping several times in the past
21:58:15 <gavinbaker> the shirts did get there eventually
21:58:18 <Fear_of_C> but it has much more ability to do that than most of the chapters do invidually
21:58:20 <skyfaller> it's one of the few things we've done every year
21:58:27 <gavinbaker> and there's a box of them now... in my bedroom, actually
21:58:32 <contra> gavinbaker: then sign Swat up for some free swag to give out :)
21:58:32 <Fear_of_C> because it is still an order of magnitude larger than any of the chapters
21:58:47 <gavinbaker> Fear_of_C: define "larger," but sure
21:58:59 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: do we have enough shirts right now for all the chapters?
21:59:02 <Fear_of_C> and anyway, the admin stuff should be centralized, i think, unless chapters opt out of such coordination
21:59:05 <gavinbaker> and are we missing any sizes or anything like that?
21:59:12 <gavinbaker> Fear_of_C: let's talk about this a bit later :)
21:59:20 <poningru> yes can we get some large shirts please?
21:59:27 <skyfaller> we are missing sizes, we'll have to print more
21:59:32 <skyfaller> we are almost out of large and have no XL
21:59:36 <gavinbaker> aww, poningru, you look so cute in the one you have!
21:59:43 <poningru> my beer belly does not like the tiny shirt
21:59:48 * poningru beats up gavinbaker
21:59:49 * nile chuckles
21:59:51 <pyrak> i'm wearing mine now ;)
22:00:26 <skyfaller> So the main point of that is that we're going to need volunteers for various things, including graphic design, printing stuff e.g. t-shirts or buttons, etc.
22:00:32 <gavinbaker> so only good-looking people can wear FC.o shirts. nice PR control! | jk
22:00:38 <skyfaller> I guess I'll grab something from later in the agenda real quick
22:00:42 <nile> gavinbaker, ow.
22:00:49 <contra> FCorg calendar
22:00:52 <skyfaller> we'd like to have volunteer meetings in the future
22:01:00 <poningru> gavinbaker: I have a body of a god
22:01:05 <poningru> buddha
22:01:06 <contra> "wearing nothing but EFF pasties"
22:01:14 <skyfaller> to "crowdsource" some of this labor
22:01:37 <contra> I feel like anyone who uses the term crowdsource after being at the national conference can only do so with at least 15% irony
22:01:42 <skyfaller> traditionally the way we handle volunteers on the national level is through the "Core" list, which is composed of all people who want to work on FC national stuff
22:02:07 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: but in the box o' swag that arrives in august or sept., the chapters will be getting some FC.o shirts, right?
22:02:14 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: yes
22:02:27 <skyfaller> although if we don't manage to print more before then, you won't be able to get larger than a Large
22:02:33 <gavinbaker> but later we'll print more, and everyone will be happy.
22:02:39 <skyfaller> quite so
22:02:40 <gavinbaker> ok, so what else can FC.o do for chapters
22:02:41 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: mailing lists for chapters?
22:02:49 <skyfaller> yeah, we covered that under web hosting
22:03:07 <skyfaller> and as we said, if you want web hosting help, you can stay after this meeting
22:03:15 <skyfaller> and we'll give you whatever webspace stuff you nee
22:03:16 <gavinbaker> good, just checking your memory.
22:03:16 <skyfaller> *need
22:03:28 <gavinbaker> so how can chapters get advice / camaraderie?
22:03:29 <skyfaller> this is why real-time minutes would be good :P
22:03:37 <skyfaller> heh, and gavin is holding me to the agenda
22:03:41 <skyfaller> foiling my attempts to skip ahead
22:04:08 <skyfaller> So another thing we wanted to talk about is how you can get advice
22:04:14 <skyfaller> or just hobnob with other chapter members
22:04:25 <skyfaller> obviously you can use this IRC channel
22:04:34 <skyfaller> a bunch of us hang out here constantly
22:04:48 * fco_guest02 (n=ca394196@30.145.221.202.bf.2iij.net) has joined #freeculture
22:04:52 <skyfaller> and we hope to have Chapters meetings on a regular basis here in the future
22:04:54 <gavinbaker> just so everyone knows, FC.o is a great place to find a boyfriend.
22:05:09 * pyrak is single ;)
22:05:10 * fco_guest02 has quit (Client Quit)
22:05:10 <contra> gavinbaker: I doubt there are women here right now ;-)
22:05:12 <poningru> totally
22:05:16 <erinR> hey i'm still here
22:05:17 * poningru looks at erinR
22:05:20 <poningru> rofl
22:05:24 <gavinbaker> ladies, you gonna prove contra wrong?
22:05:25 <erinR> i'm just listening
22:05:25 <skyfaller> mllerustad: is also a female
22:05:31 <contra> if there's one woman, it's even creepier
22:05:32 <poningru> but taken ;)
22:05:32 <gavinbaker> as is mind|wandering
22:05:50 <skyfaller> mllerustad started the Claremont chapter, and also is my girlfriend who I met through FreeCulture.org. Hi Karen!
22:05:55 <skyfaller> see, FC.o can find you love
22:06:07 <mllerustad> Hi, skyfaller!
22:06:11 <gavinbaker> selling us high there, skyfaller
22:06:13 <mllerustad> :p
22:06:14 <poningru> awwwwwww
22:06:16 <contra> you guys are probably in the same room right now
22:06:17 <skyfaller> also, this proves that there are at least two females in the channel
22:06:21 <poningru> rofl
22:06:24 <mllerustad> contra: Bingo.
22:06:25 <contra> which is the kind of relationship you get through FCorg: IRC-based :)
22:06:39 <skyfaller> ouch
22:06:41 <nile> okay, this is getting silly. (and depressing =P). MOVING ON!
22:06:46 <gavinbaker> so IRC's great! what else ya got?
22:06:53 <contra> I still occasionally slip and say "slash me" IRL conversation
22:06:54 * mllerustad can has two x chromosomes?!?
22:06:55 <skyfaller> we also have mailing lists
22:06:55 <poningru> EMAIL
22:07:02 <nile> email sucks ass.
22:07:11 <skyfaller> there is the FC-discuss list
22:07:13 <contra> yes, more actual chapter members need to use the mailing list
22:07:14 <skyfaller> which you can sign up for
22:07:23 <contra> it's very...other-group dominated
22:07:31 <skyfaller> I must admit that it seems to have been invaded by people who are not actually part of FreeCulture.org
22:07:37 <poningru> rofl
22:07:39 <erinR> like who?
22:07:41 <skyfaller> but I can't figure out how to get rid of them without seeming like an asshole
22:07:46 <poningru> COPYRIGHT NEEDS TO BE BANNED
22:07:49 <nile> how often do we have national get-togethers? does it always happen annually, or just when someone-or-another thinks to organize one?
22:07:49 <skyfaller> maybe I am an asshole, oh well
22:07:59 <skyfaller> nile: that's next on the agenda!
22:08:05 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: "oops! our server lost the data. except, we recovered all of it, except apparently your email address. our bad!"
22:08:08 <contra> not to be ironic, but I think proper use of the mailing list for advice/requests could helpfully "crowd source" a lot of our problems about supporting chapters
22:08:18 <erinR> let's have the next one out here: the bay area's weather is nicer than boston
22:08:26 <erinR> :)
22:08:28 <gavinbaker> so there's this crazy thing called the chapters list
22:08:33 <poningru> no no... sunny florida
22:08:42 <gavinbaker> which, wouldn't you know it, is for the chapter leaders
22:08:43 <skyfaller> mllerustad, cameronparkins are talking about organizing a west coast conference for next year
22:08:44 <pyrak> bay area ftw
22:08:49 <erinR> hurray!
22:08:51 <pyrak> wait, which bay?
22:08:56 <poningru> tampa bay
22:08:57 <poningru> !!
22:09:00 <gavinbaker> pyrak: the Gulf of Tonkin, d00d
22:09:03 <skyfaller> pyrak: you can help them too
22:09:10 <skyfaller> and erinR!
22:09:16 <skyfaller> wow, we actually have people on the west coast now
22:09:20 <cameronparkins> skyfaller, millerustad: discussions haven't begun yet, but its still on my radar for things i want to get togheter
22:09:20 <skyfaller> how strange
22:09:22 <erinR> maybe lessig will agree to talk
22:09:24 <paulproteus> erin, Hey, where are you exactly...?
22:09:25 <gavinbaker> and some our of West Coast buddy orgz
22:09:28 <erinR> at stanford
22:09:30 <gavinbaker> like paulproteus !
22:09:36 <skyfaller> she's only said that like 3 times guys
22:09:53 <Fear_of_C> this might be crazy, but could we re-register the mailing list when we re-register the chapters?
22:09:58 <Fear_of_C> or something of that sort
22:10:03 <gavinbaker> Fear_of_C: or maybe even before then?
22:10:08 <poningru> err why?
22:10:10 <skyfaller> heh, we could do that
22:10:10 <contra> I don't want to kick out the other orgs from the mailing list
22:10:12 <poningru> we might lose readership
22:10:19 <gavinbaker> no no, there's a chapters list
22:10:24 <gavinbaker> i assume that's what Fear_of_C means
22:10:27 <Fear_of_C> it would be more polite than GTFO my mailing list
22:10:28 <gavinbaker> at least, that's what i means
22:10:29 <cameronparkins> do we have a list of all the active west caost chapters?
22:10:31 <cameronparkins> coast*
22:10:35 <contra> Fear_of_C: we have to get our mailing list back on track. Or maybe people just ignore my posts
22:10:42 <gavinbaker> we need to get our chapter leaders on the chapters list
22:10:45 <skyfaller> I mean, the point of the FC-discuss list was to be open to outsiders
22:10:51 <erinR> is santa cruz's chapter still active?
22:10:56 <Fear_of_C> also, I don't know if I'm on the mailing list, or which mailing list(s) I'm on
22:11:01 <skyfaller> but the problem is that no actual relevant content is getting posted by actual FC members
22:11:03 <gavinbaker> there's nothing wrong fc-disco. we just need something more, er, manageable
22:11:07 <gavinbaker> for our seekrit cabals
22:11:16 <poningru> skyfaller: not at the expense of idiocy being introduced into it
22:11:33 * conley heads off to the bathroom
22:11:35 <skyfaller> yeah, so gavinbaker is saying that we can just take our intelligent conversations elsewhere
22:11:41 <skyfaller> i.e. to the Chapters list
22:11:45 <skyfaller> which you all should be subscribed to
22:12:00 <skyfaller> when we say "chapter leaders", we don't mean one person per chapter
22:12:13 <gavinbaker> and boy, it'd be great if people actually used the chapters list. let's talk!
22:12:14 <skyfaller> any chapter members who want to talk to other chapter members can be subscribed
22:12:30 <skyfaller> so conley, your minions can be subscribed to it too
22:12:39 <contra> dividing up the mailing list is only going to make it less effective
22:12:48 <contra> one big mailing list will be fine until we actual get some REAL volume
22:12:53 <contra> (thus spake Ben)
22:13:02 <skyfaller> well, the Chapters list can be specifically for chapters stuff
22:13:14 <skyfaller> while FC-discuss is about anything at all related to free culture issues
22:13:24 <skyfaller> and you can go have philosophical debates and flamewars there
22:13:34 <skyfaller> while we keep Chapters on task and on topic
22:13:38 <Fear_of_C> agreed
22:13:40 <poningru> \0/ flamewars
22:13:54 <skyfaller> flameware?
22:13:59 * conley reenters and takes a seat
22:14:00 <contra> I think this problem is generally solved by technology. Most people use mail clients with folders, filtering, threading, etc. It's easy to skip what you don't want
22:14:08 <gavinbaker> whenever you want advice about how to do something at your chapter -- post it to chapters list!
22:14:11 <contra> I know I ignore most of the list postings :)
22:14:12 <Fear_of_C> some people use clients with that stuff
22:14:16 * nile_ (n=nile@ip72-209-65-174.ga.at.cox.net) has joined #freeculture
22:14:18 <skyfaller> what gavinbaker said
22:14:19 <nile_> anyway.
22:14:24 <skyfaller> if you want help with your chapter, post to Chapters
22:14:30 <skyfaller> and on-topic advice will be rendered
22:14:35 <Fear_of_C> some of us prefer to just limit the input in the first place
22:14:48 <skyfaller> if you want to discuss general free culture issues, post to FC-discuss
22:14:48 <gavinbaker> Fear_of_C: then don't subscribe to FC-disco ;)
22:14:48 <Fear_of_C> and will unsubscribe to anything that doesn't get down to business enough % of the time
22:15:00 <contra> me, I like when people send me emails because it helps to defray some of the feeling of being ignored when I send emails to other people
22:15:00 <Fear_of_C> I seriously doubt that I am subscribed
22:15:05 <skyfaller> I think FC-discuss can be useeful, it was useful in the past
22:15:15 <gavinbaker> Fear_of_C: you'd know if you were. your guitar would explode in your hands
22:15:18 <skyfaller> it's just not useful for specific chapters help for instance
22:15:28 <skyfaller> but yeah, we have mailing lists
22:15:29 <skyfaller> moving on!
22:15:31 <gavinbaker> so for help with your chapter, post to chapters list. and if you see a question there, reply to it!
22:15:41 <gavinbaker> (if you're not on the list, bug... skyfaller or paulproteus or someone)
22:15:50 <poningru> yeah gavinbaker
22:15:54 <poningru> bug him
22:16:19 <skyfaller> so yeah, another thing we have is a webpage that aggregates the personal blogs of FC members
22:16:24 <skyfaller> if they want to be aggregated
22:16:30 <pyrak> planet?
22:16:33 <skyfaller> yeah
22:16:41 <poningru> pyrak: i.e planet.ubuntulinux.com
22:16:41 <skyfaller> http://planet.freeculture.org/
22:16:42 * bcb2114_ (n=brendan@c-69-180-189-36.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) has joined #freeculture
22:16:46 <poningru> err e.g
22:16:48 <skyfaller> it's not heavily populated
22:16:51 * poningru shakes fist at nile
22:16:59 <skyfaller> but if you have a personal blog and you want it on there, we can put it there
22:17:09 <skyfaller> and then you can read about the adventures of your fellow FC members
22:17:14 <pyrak> skyfaller, so the posts on the planet are not necessarily fc based?
22:17:27 <skyfaller> pyrak: no, they're your personal blog about whatever you want to write about
22:17:33 <skyfaller> it's just so that people can get to know each other
22:17:39 <skyfaller> even though they don't live in the same place or anything
22:17:40 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: can we populate planet, and make it pretty, and publicize it more?
22:17:48 <pyrak> ok, i'll talk to you later about adding madebyparker.com/blog :)
22:17:48 <conley> how does someone get on the planet?
22:17:50 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: sure! but we need more blogs I guess
22:18:01 <gavinbaker> it's kinda ghettoized now
22:18:04 <skyfaller> conley: ask me or gavinbaker, I guess
22:18:18 <conley> ok, I am conley.toejammer.net/blog
22:18:22 <gavinbaker> uh, i'll post to chapters asking people for their blog feeds, and you'll send them to me, for the time being ;)
22:18:23 <skyfaller> we'll figure out a way to scale that process better some other time
22:18:29 <skyfaller> sure, that works gavinbaker
22:18:31 <skyfaller> moving on!
22:18:31 <nile_> so the Planet isn't the same as the aggregated FC.o chapters thing?
22:18:36 <skyfaller> nile_: no
22:18:48 <gavinbaker> nile_: correct, not the same thing
22:18:52 <skyfaller> http://freeculture.org/chapternews/ is the aggregator for Chapter blogs
22:19:00 <skyfaller> which is also mostly populated by blog posts from Peru
22:19:11 <skyfaller> b/c none of our US chapters have used their blogs recently
22:19:14 <skyfaller> which is sad, really
22:19:27 <skyfaller> but we'll tackle that another time
22:19:33 * bcb2114_ has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:19:42 * nile_ aggregates his Flying Spaghetti Monster post
22:19:47 <poningru> aye no
22:19:51 <poningru> dont do it
22:19:55 <skyfaller> noo, did we lose bcb2114 ?
22:20:02 <skyfaller> anyway, moving on
22:20:06 <skyfaller> Summits!
22:20:14 <skyfaller> or Conferences
22:20:23 <skyfaller> physical get-togethers! meetups!
22:20:30 <nile_> how often have they happened in the past?
22:20:40 <skyfaller> nile_: they've happened about once a year in the past
22:20:49 <skyfaller> one year we also had a regional conference in NYC
22:21:10 <skyfaller> I think that we should stick with one or two big national conferences a year, where we try to get EVERYONE together
22:21:17 <skyfaller> but we should also try to have more local meetups
22:21:19 <conley> Is there an rss feed on the planet? I can't find one
22:21:23 <gavinbaker> like, over the summer
22:21:25 <BrianRowe> on the confernce note we need to plan the national confernce further in advance if we want west coasters to attend
22:21:39 <skyfaller> conley: it's a horrible web page design, we'll need to overhaul it sometime
22:21:45 <skyfaller> but it does produce an RSS feed
22:21:52 <gavinbaker> summer mixers, particularly for interns and stuff like that
22:22:10 <gavinbaker> BrianRowe: yeah, it's been hard for anybody from the non-immediate vicinity
22:22:15 <gavinbaker> especially with no travel funding
22:22:26 <skyfaller> yeah, since many of us are in different cities from our schools, this is a great opportunity to meet people from other chapters
22:22:35 <paulproteus> conley, For the RSS feed, my Firefox detects and shows the icon.
22:22:43 <skyfaller> so let's try to get together this summer!
22:22:56 <conley> yea, I figured it out
22:23:04 <skyfaller> to facilitate summer get-togethers, I'd like to propose rebooting the regional mailing lists
22:23:31 <skyfaller> traditionally we had mailing lists for large metro areas
22:23:57 <skyfaller> unfortunately when Leafyhost's server crashed we lost those lists, but now is a good time to start them again
22:24:01 <skyfaller> so we'
22:24:21 <skyfaller> we'll be advertising in the near future local mailing lists, and you can sign up for them and organize get togethers with one another
22:24:23 * nile_ likes the idea of physical meetups. real life for the win.
22:24:26 <skyfaller> in the FC-approved decentralized fashion
22:24:47 <skyfaller> you can also use the national wiki for that sort of thing if you want
22:24:59 <skyfaller> wiki + mailing list should be enough technology to get y'all together
22:25:07 <nile_> I don't know how effective using regional mailing lists would be, especially if you're only in the region for a short while
22:25:13 <gavinbaker> nile_: you just like the cider :)
22:25:19 <skyfaller> nile_: well, if the mailing list archives are public
22:25:20 <nile_> gavinbaker: pshaw
22:25:25 <hj_> jajaja yeah i think my reginal meeting wont be a wild party...
22:25:27 <skyfaller> you can read them before subscribing
22:25:32 <skyfaller> or never subscribe at all
22:25:35 <gavinbaker> lurkerrr
22:25:50 <BrianRowe> might want to try to get people togeter at other local events like copynight or Net^2 events
22:26:04 <skyfaller> yeah, we support Copynight http://www.copynight.org/
22:26:04 <gavinbaker> hey, crazy idea, guys. since we have planet for blog rss feeds, can we do something similar for rss feeds from photo sites like flickr?
22:26:07 <poningru> copynight++
22:26:14 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: heh, we could do that too
22:26:31 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: file a bug on our bug tracker https://launchpad.net/web/+bugs
22:26:32 <gavinbaker> fileabug--
22:26:39 <skyfaller> :P
22:26:48 * pyrak wishes there was an open source alternative to flickr
22:27:03 * nile has quit (Remote closed the connection)
22:27:10 <skyfaller> so hj_ brings up a good point
22:27:15 <Fear_of_C> make one
22:27:15 <skyfaller> what if there aren't other people in your area
22:27:22 <skyfaller> that's why we have the national meetups
22:27:24 <pyrak> recruit!
22:27:28 <pyrak> oh
22:27:32 <skyfaller> certain places like the Midwest are sparsely populated
22:27:42 <skyfaller> especially with Free Culture folks
22:27:56 <skyfaller> but if we can get everyone together in one place, then that matters less
22:28:12 <skyfaller> we'd like to have both a west coast and east coast conference next year, I guess we'll see if we can pull it off
22:28:15 <skyfaller> but one thing is clear
22:28:28 <skyfaller> without funding to help cover people's transportation, these conferences won't be as awesome as they could be
22:28:36 <skyfaller> which we will get to later in the agenda!
22:28:48 <skyfaller> (sorry that this meeting is getting a little long, we'll try to hurry it up)
22:29:19 <skyfaller> So, that's all I have to say about physical meetups for the moment
22:29:27 <skyfaller> hopefully the regional meetups will go well this summer
22:29:28 * mark007 has quit ("leaving")
22:29:32 <gavinbaker> there's plenty of ways to make friends. so make friends :)
22:29:44 <skyfaller> and hopefully people like cameronparkins will help us organize national summits for next year
22:29:48 <skyfaller> moving on
22:29:49 <poningru> skyfaller: yeah in teh south east we are the only people
22:29:57 <skyfaller> News from FreeCulture.org!
22:30:03 <skyfaller> bcb2114: are you still there?
22:30:22 <skyfaller> guess not
22:30:41 <skyfaller> we have several potential national projects
22:30:50 <skyfaller> which we could get our chapters working on
22:30:54 <gavinbaker> slash volunteers
22:31:18 * contra has quit ()
22:31:53 <skyfaller> One example which I wanted Brendan from Columbia to talk about is Open Textbooks
22:32:31 <skyfaller> Brendan has been working on a front-end for finding open access / public domain textbooks for your classes
22:32:43 <skyfaller> it's an expansion of an idea that our Columbia chapter came up with
22:33:05 <gavinbaker> the idea is to just make a simple tool so that people won't waste money buying a copy of Moby Dick if they don't want to
22:33:10 <hj_> skyfaller: is there a demo we can look at, ? it would help a lot to my Print ond Demand proyect
22:33:12 <gavinbaker> and promote the public domain in the process
22:33:22 <skyfaller> at Columbia they handed out public domain textbooks on flashdrives to students
22:33:36 <poningru> soo cool
22:33:42 <skyfaller> it was especially relevant at Columbia because one of their core classes is about classic literature
22:33:42 <poningru> gavinbaker, nile_ we should do that
22:33:47 <skyfaller> which is almost entirely public domain
22:33:55 * mark007 (n=mark007@pool-71-101-191-76.tampfl.dsl-w.verizon.net) has joined #freeculture
22:33:58 <skyfaller> so students didn't have to buy textbooks for that class if they didn't want to
22:34:02 <pyrak> this is neat, i remember musing about this same idea in here before, another nice thing would be instructions on what equipment is needed to make hard copies
22:34:13 <skyfaller> we want to generalize that, to encourage people to make open access textbooks and such
22:34:23 <Fear_of_C> some local network filesharing like DC++ could take out the overhead
22:34:55 <skyfaller> one idea was making a Facebook frontend, an application that can detect what classes you have and what textbooks are required for it, and tell you if there are free copies available
22:35:01 <skyfaller> but that's just one idea of many
22:35:02 <Fear_of_C> it would be cool if the necessary texts were all behind the firewall
22:35:02 <gavinbaker> s/Facebook/"web app"
22:35:15 <Fear_of_C> Facebook is good for marketing this kind of thing
22:35:19 <gavinbaker> the other ideas that have been kicking around (which are all on the wiki)
22:35:32 <gavinbaker> all of these are things where some initial planning has already gone into it
22:35:51 <gavinbaker> so we don't necessarily have to go forward with them -- and they all need volunteers to help -- but they're some ideas for starters
22:36:00 <BrianRowe> the SU chapter is pushing the idea of updating Wikipedia entries for supreme court cases we cover in class. we did a few last spring
22:36:13 <gavinbaker> we've talked with the Digital Freedom Campaign about concerns on/near college campuses about p2p filesharing
22:36:18 <nile_> man, that's a great idea.
22:36:30 <gavinbaker> we've talked with the Future of Music Coalition about concerts on/near college campuses about Net neutrality (their Rock the Net campaign)
22:36:56 <gavinbaker> uh, we have this idea for an interactive open access repository for student e-prints and working papers
22:37:04 <gavinbaker> (if you don't know what that means, ask me later...)
22:37:18 <gavinbaker> like the first half of PLoS One, except for students, in any subject
22:37:33 <gavinbaker> uh, and there's this crazy thing going on to create a survey for U.S. Presidential candidates
22:37:36 <nile_> first half? what's the second half of PLoS ONE?
22:37:45 <gavinbaker> nile_: the second half is a formally peer-reviewed journal
22:37:53 <nile_> gotcha
22:37:57 <gavinbaker> the survey, a bunch of "grown-up" orgs are working on
22:38:07 <gavinbaker> and it's pretty flippin' sweet, if i do say so myself.
22:38:13 <nile_> who's heading up that candidates survey thing?
22:38:15 <gavinbaker> (something similar happened in france earlier this year)
22:38:19 <gavinbaker> nile_: brendan, i think
22:38:36 * bcb2114 has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:38:36 <skyfaller> which is why it's a shame that he seems to have signed off, but yeah
22:38:40 <gavinbaker> ok, so those are some ideas. we need help on all of them -- or we could abort any of them. YOU will decide :)
22:38:40 <poningru> oh seriously?
22:38:48 <gavinbaker> at the next volunteer meeting
22:38:52 <gavinbaker> which brings us to...
22:38:54 <poningru> abort!!! abort!!! abort!!!
22:38:58 <skyfaller> ...
22:39:02 <poningru> :p
22:39:07 <gavinbaker> well, actually, that's later. in a bit we'll talk about how to get involved with FC.o
22:39:13 * nile_ aborts poningru with a /kick
22:39:19 <gavinbaker> uh, so that's my spiel.
22:39:27 <skyfaller> OK, so next subject
22:39:37 <skyfaller> IS EVERYONE PAYING ATTENTION? THIS IS IMPORTANT
22:39:44 * pyrak widens eyes
22:39:52 <Fear_of_C> ***wakes up
22:39:58 <skyfaller> So next is The Future of FreeCulture.org
22:40:13 <BrianRowe> ...
22:40:14 <skyfaller> http://wiki.freeculture.org/2007-07-15 is our agenda for those who forgot
22:40:30 <skyfaller> So one problem that has plagued our organization is ... a lack of organization
22:40:49 <skyfaller> we have no by-laws or constitution or any founding document
22:41:01 <skyfaller> so it's unclear how decisions are made
22:41:11 <conley> Fear_of_C: type /me to do an action
22:41:14 <skyfaller> a while ago a bunch of people appointed themselves to a Board of Directors
22:41:23 <skyfaller> including myself
22:41:27 <Fear_of_C> conley: thanks
22:41:34 * Fear_of_C thanks conley
22:41:39 <conley> Fear_of_C: np
22:41:50 <skyfaller> there were theoretically elections, but since all seats were uncontested we didn't even bother voting
22:42:10 <skyfaller> and it's not clear how we would have conducted the election properly anyway
22:42:16 <nile_> interesting
22:42:20 <skyfaller> this is one of many examples of the evils of not having bylaws
22:42:30 <skyfaller> it's important to know how the organization works and how decisions are made
22:43:01 <skyfaller> and it's important to have an organizational structure, a system that can outlive any single personality
22:43:12 <skyfaller> an institution
22:43:38 <skyfaller> we have a draft of by-laws that we have written up on the wiki
22:43:44 <skyfaller> at http://wiki.freeculture.org/Bylaws
22:43:57 <skyfaller> it's still got some editing left to go
22:44:17 <conley> I love the pseudo-official lingo
22:44:33 <skyfaller> but I'd like to officially open a comments period for these by-laws
22:45:02 <nile_> skyfaller: who ratifies it? when do we plan on having it become official?
22:45:17 <BrianRowe> do you want comments on the disscussion page or people editing the bi-laws directly?
22:45:33 <skyfaller> and once we have collected comments, we should do a second "release candidate"
22:45:39 <skyfaller> and then we should have the chapters ratify them
22:45:45 <skyfaller> ratify the bylaws
22:45:50 <gavinbaker> BrianRowe: discuss on the Talk page
22:46:01 <skyfaller> yes, on that page click the "discussion" tab
22:46:08 <gavinbaker> (we wanted to use the GPLv3 revision system, but we couldn't get it up+running soon enough)
22:46:10 <skyfaller> to leave your own comments and read those of other people
22:46:19 * cameronparkins has quit (Connection timed out)
22:46:47 <skyfaller> once the by-laws are ratified, we will have an official organizational structure
22:46:59 <gavinbaker> so is the Talk page the "official" forum for discussing the bylaws? not the mailing list or IRC, e.g.?
22:47:25 <skyfaller> well, the Talk page is public and on the web
22:47:33 <Fear_of_C> it's generally best to avoid cluttering the mailing lists
22:47:41 <gavinbaker> Fear_of_C: hah, very funny
22:47:42 <skyfaller> you can talk about it elsewhere, but *official* comments that you want to work into the bylaws
22:47:47 <skyfaller> should go on that Talk page
22:47:54 <skyfaller> all other discussion will be considered unofficial
22:48:20 <gavinbaker> another question, actually
22:48:27 <gavinbaker> how will RC2 be prepared?
22:48:36 <gavinbaker> like who decides what goes in the release candidate?
22:48:49 <gavinbaker> "consensus"?
22:48:59 <skyfaller> well, that's a good question, isn't it? too bad we don't have a way to make decisions in this org!
22:49:08 <poningru> rofl
22:49:12 <nile_> it makes it more fun
22:49:15 <skyfaller> we can run things by the Board of Directors, which was essentially self-appointed
22:49:25 <skyfaller> we can do consensus
22:49:43 <skyfaller> among all the chapters / chapter members who are payinga attention
22:49:50 <Fear_of_C> if we are looking to replace the current governing structure, then i think it eventually has to come down to some kind of chapter vote
22:49:50 <skyfaller> in practice, I guess we'll do both
22:50:01 <gavinbaker> Fear_of_C: right, the chapters will vote on the RC
22:50:04 <skyfaller> Fear_of_C: yes, that's what the ratification process is
22:50:06 <gavinbaker> to "ratify" it
22:50:14 <skyfaller> if it doesn't get ratified, then we have to go edit it some more
22:50:20 <gavinbaker> i just wondered, where does the RC come from... i guess the ether / the wikimonster
22:50:22 <pyrak> we need both a house and a senate
22:50:29 <skyfaller> so it's in everyone's interest to get the by-laws to the point where all the chapters can be ratified
22:50:31 <Fear_of_C> ok, so this happens after the redatabasing?
22:50:35 <pyrak> so chapters get equal say, but bigger chapters get more say
22:50:35 <poningru> oye vey
22:50:45 <poningru> pyrak: too complicated
22:50:46 <skyfaller> pyrak: I have arguments as to why that isn't true
22:50:57 <pyrak> skyfaller, i was mostly joking
22:51:05 <skyfaller> we can discuss that in detail later
22:51:11 <pyrak> roger roger
22:51:11 <skyfaller> so yeah, once we have the by-laws ratified, we'll know how to hold elections
22:51:25 <skyfaller> and it's high time that we elected a new board of directors and got some new blood into the org
22:51:34 <skyfaller> I'd like to get the elections finished before school starts
22:51:37 <gavinbaker> heh, sure you don't want to use the bug tracker to write the bylaws?
22:51:41 <skyfaller> ...
22:51:47 <skyfaller> pretty sure, yes
22:51:54 <gavinbaker> that'd be fun ;)
22:52:18 <skyfaller> so I'd like to hold elections before school starts, so that we'll have our new leadership ready before people get too busy
22:52:26 <nile_> BUG #1: We're writing by-laws instead of doing something more interesting.
22:52:32 <gavinbaker> WONTFIX
22:52:43 <poningru> pwnt
22:52:44 <nile_> BUG #2: We're writing by-laws instead of doing something more interesting.
22:52:46 <skyfaller> nile_: there's no instead about it, we can do other things simultaneously :P
22:53:11 * nile_ dupes til the bug counter variable overflows and it becomes bug #1 again
22:53:21 <skyfaller> nile_: but the point is that BUG #3: "We can't do anything interesting until we get organized" trumps #1 and #@
22:53:24 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: CONFIRMED
22:53:24 <skyfaller> erm, #2
22:53:35 <gavinbaker> priority: HIGH
22:53:53 <gavinbaker> uh, so what's the timeline on this crazy plan?
22:53:56 <skyfaller> so I would appreciate everyone's help / cooperation in getting organized, and we'll be discussing this in detail over the next several weeks
22:53:57 <gavinbaker> s/crazy/"crafty"
22:54:18 <nile_> s,craft,crufty =D
22:54:19 <skyfaller> well, as I said, I'd like to hold elections and get our new Board in place before the beginning of the schoolyear
22:54:25 <skyfaller> which puts us on a tight schedule
22:54:51 <skyfaller> I'd like to set the deadline for commenting on the Bylaws for 7/29
22:54:59 <gavinbaker> paulproteus++ | for bug fixin'
22:55:14 <skyfaller> at which point we'll fix the by-laws to include everyone's comments, as far as possible
22:55:24 <gavinbaker> ok, so that's 2 weeks to comment on the bylaws?
22:55:29 <skyfaller> yep
22:55:44 <gavinbaker> that should be plenty of time to hash stuff out on the Talk page
22:55:49 <skyfaller> it's a tight schedule, and it may slip, but the more it slips the more we'll be doing stupid organizational stuff during the school year
22:55:51 * cameronparkins (n=cameronp@c-76-102-175-119.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #freeculture
22:55:53 <skyfaller> when we should be doing activism
22:56:08 <gavinbaker> s,activism,"something more interesting"
22:56:08 <cameronparkins> sorry about getting kicked off - wireless at the coffee shop went down
22:56:15 <skyfaller> so I think we can re-write the bylaws to incorporate comments in about a week
22:56:17 <gavinbaker> cameronparkins: sue the bastards
22:56:24 <skyfaller> or less than a week, I mean
22:56:36 <skyfaller> like, a day
22:56:44 <skyfaller> because we'll be incorporating comments as they are made
22:56:55 <skyfaller> we'll be working before the comment period deadline on 7/20
22:56:56 <skyfaller> erm
22:56:56 <gavinbaker> so what i'm hearing is, there's going to be a meeting on 7/29 to prepare the RC?
22:56:59 <skyfaller> 7/29
22:57:11 <cameronparkins> gavinbake: already did (ps ive got some cool stuff for you read OA, sorry I havent e-mailed it yet)
22:57:32 <skyfaller> yeah, on 7/29 we'll meet up and try to prepare the RC of the bylaws
22:57:33 <cameronparkins> gavinbaker: already did (ps ive got some cool stuff for you read OA, sorry I havent e-mailed it yet)
22:57:42 <cameronparkins> i have a knack for typos
22:57:43 <gavinbaker> cameronparkins: ooh, send it
22:58:02 <skyfaller> so I'd like to have the by-laws rewritten like that day
22:58:14 <skyfaller> then I'd like to offer the by-laws to the chapters to be ratified
22:58:34 * Christina_ (n=chatzill@ool-4579d643.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #freeculture
22:58:38 <skyfaller> I'd like to set the deadline for that on 8/5
22:58:55 <nile_> yay, it's Christina_
22:58:58 <conley> I'm going home, I suppose I will be back on in 30 minutes, is there anything you all need from me?
22:58:59 <skyfaller> August 5th, for those who are wondering what my date format is
22:59:05 <skyfaller> conley: nah, it'll be in the minutes
22:59:12 <skyfaller> sorry for the meeting taking longer than anticipated
22:59:13 <Christina_> Yes! I am so glad you're still here- just got back from Boston
22:59:20 <conley> no prob, later
22:59:24 * conley has quit ("Leaving.")
22:59:27 <skyfaller> Christina_: heh, I don't think most of us are glad that we're still here
22:59:32 * hj_ will be back in 20 min...
22:59:32 <Christina_> hahahaha
22:59:33 <skyfaller> but at least one of us is happy :)
22:59:38 * pyrak yawns
22:59:40 <pyrak> :P
22:59:44 <skyfaller> we're almost done folks
22:59:51 <skyfaller> stick with us for a few more minutes
23:00:00 <Christina_> so obviously I have missed a lot, I will be trying to catch on
23:00:10 <skyfaller> So I'd like to have the by-laws ratified by August 5th
23:00:13 <skyfaller> by all the chapters
23:00:14 <nile_> Christina_: gavinbaker is writing up minutes, I believe
23:00:35 <Christina_> ok great thank you
23:00:36 <skyfaller> which would allow us to begin nominating people for the Board of Directors
23:00:40 <nile_> skyfaller: sounds good. chapters = chapters' presidents?
23:01:19 <skyfaller> nile_: that's a detail of the by-laws, but I guess, one vote per chapter is what I've proposed in the by-laws
23:01:40 <gavinbaker> i guess each chapter decides how their vote is cast?
23:01:45 <skyfaller> yeah, that's what I propose
23:01:53 <skyfaller> it doesn't have to be their president
23:02:08 <gavinbaker> so, unilateral decision by the president, vote of the exec. board, vote of the membership... however the chapter wants
23:02:14 * nile_ blinks
23:02:16 <skyfaller> consensus (ugh)
23:02:21 <skyfaller> whatever works for each chapter
23:02:25 <nile_> okay then
23:02:29 <gavinbaker> there's the meta-decision of how to decide that, but for now, chapters will just "decide" something and that's the vote :D
23:02:45 <skyfaller> yeah, each chapter can figure that out in their own by-laws or whatever :P
23:02:48 <gavinbaker> later on, each chapter can have their own discussion about how to vote
23:02:54 <skyfaller> we're just working on the national org's by-laws right now
23:03:16 <skyfaller> so by 8/12, I want to open the polls, and let chapters start voting for the Board of Directors
23:03:26 <skyfaller> I want to close the polls by 8/19
23:03:34 <skyfaller> and then we'll have a Board of Directors
23:03:39 <skyfaller> once the votes are counted
23:03:49 <pyrak> cap on number of board members?
23:03:57 <skyfaller> pyrak: a detail of the by-laws
23:04:06 <skyfaller> it'll depend on how many people are nominated, I suppose
23:04:18 <skyfaller> we've proposed 5, 7 or 9 board members in the by-laws
23:04:28 <skyfaller> but it's a detail that isn't that vitally important to me
23:04:38 <skyfaller> that week, the new Board of Directors will have their first meeting
23:04:45 <skyfaller> which will be right at the start of the school year
23:05:03 <gavinbaker> pyrak: we can discuss on the Talk page how many board members there should be
23:05:07 <skyfaller> so we'll have a full organization organized and ready to take on the world by the end of August
23:05:18 <pyrak> s/on/over :)
23:05:26 <poningru> lol
23:05:53 <skyfaller> which will allow us to get back to the business of activism just as the school year starts
23:06:05 <skyfaller> however, we will simultaneously have to prepare for the school year itself
23:06:37 * tvol has quit (Connection timed out)
23:06:38 <gavinbaker> uh, so about that
23:06:43 <gavinbaker> let's get some volunteers!
23:06:55 <skyfaller> "how to get involved with FreeCulture.org"
23:07:04 <skyfaller> http://wiki.freeculture.org/2007-07-15 again is the agenda, Christina_
23:07:18 <Christina_> thanks i have been checking it out
23:07:43 <skyfaller> so we used to have volunteer meetings all the time
23:07:59 <skyfaller> we had something called the "Core team" which consisted of everyone who was interested in volunteering at the national level
23:08:12 <skyfaller> it had its own mailing list, the Core list
23:08:20 <skyfaller> and it got things done sometimes pretty well :)
23:08:45 * nile (i=nile@tor/regular/nile) has joined #freeculture
23:08:51 <skyfaller> its main fault was the lack of organization / decision-making structure, which is something that I hope the by-laws and elections will take care of by the end of the summer
23:09:03 <skyfaller> but until then we'll just have to forge ahead in anarchy ;-)
23:09:10 <skyfaller> I'd like to re-create that list
23:09:12 * nile shakes fist
23:09:17 <gavinbaker> s/anarchy/consensus
23:09:33 <skyfaller> and get people organized and working on the stuff that we need to do before the school year starts
23:09:44 <skyfaller> so that we can start the semester on the right foot
23:09:49 <gavinbaker> there's also the broad question of having FC.o open to input/involvement overall
23:09:49 <skyfaller> so how can you get involved
23:09:58 <gavinbaker> which is important in two ways
23:10:06 <gavinbaker> both because FC.o needs more people to help out
23:10:09 <Christina_> I know that at the conference I mentioned that I would be interested in acting as the press point person
23:10:23 <Christina_> would still love to do that
23:10:25 <gavinbaker> and because FC.o *should* be open to volunteers from the chapters
23:10:33 <Christina_> agreed
23:10:35 <gavinbaker> Christina_: great, noted -- we used to have a press person
23:10:42 <gavinbaker> there actually used to be a press team
23:10:51 <gavinbaker> it didn't always work great... but we have to try again
23:10:55 <gavinbaker> and keep trying and tinkering until it works
23:10:57 <Christina_> need a self-appointed comm director? im the girl
23:10:59 <Christina_> haha
23:11:19 <skyfaller> there have been various ideas about how we can do volunteerism better
23:11:35 <skyfaller> obviously if we're more open with the tasks that need to be done
23:11:45 <skyfaller> then it's easier for volunteers to chip in
23:11:52 <skyfaller> lowering the barrier to entry is an excellent goal
23:11:56 <Christina_> let's prioritize
23:12:02 <pyrak> what if we approached it in an almost craigslit-type way?
23:12:03 <Christina_> where do we need the most help?
23:12:21 <skyfaller> Christina_: we need help everywhere, it's a little hard to prioritize at the moment. Give me a sec
23:12:23 <gavinbaker> Christina_: we'll have to save this for another meeting, unfortunately
23:12:29 <gavinbaker> we've been here for 2h+ at this point
23:12:31 <Christina_> craig's list is amazing, i just held an arts event in boston the majority of people who came to help were because of craig's list
23:12:38 <gavinbaker> which is why we need to have volunteer meetings again
23:12:53 <gavinbaker> so... when's the next volunteer meeting? ( skyfaller? )
23:13:13 <skyfaller> heh, I wanted to briefly talk about where we've done successful volunteer work recently
23:13:26 <skyfaller> specifically, the Web Team
23:13:35 <pyrak> ftw
23:13:40 * nile_ has quit ("leaving")
23:13:40 * hj_ is bkack and loves the / me coomand
23:13:48 <skyfaller> the Web Team is the only surviving "Team" from all of the teams we used to have
23:13:53 <skyfaller> and it's still doing great work
23:13:55 <skyfaller> why is that?
23:14:06 <gavinbaker> well... there were long stretches of inactivity, weren't there?
23:14:15 <gavinbaker> and there were some pretty significant failures
23:14:22 * Yaco2 has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:14:23 <gavinbaker> so... it's not a perfect team :)
23:14:26 <skyfaller> sure, our webhost died and lost all of our data
23:14:34 <skyfaller> and our website was offline for a few weeks
23:14:36 <gavinbaker> and we had no backups (or, not complete)
23:14:46 <skyfaller> but that's not what I want to focus on ;-)
23:14:50 <skyfaller> it gets points for showing up
23:14:53 <gavinbaker> heh
23:15:00 <skyfaller> unlike the other teams which fell out of existence
23:15:17 <gavinbaker> well, Core Team has sort of defaulted to the Board
23:15:23 <gavinbaker> but everything else has vanished
23:15:28 <skyfaller> one thing that I think has helped the web team is the fact that its tasks were broken down into manageable parts
23:15:33 <pyrak> skyfaller, i think one reason the web team is successful is, like you said, entry is really easy
23:15:41 <skyfaller> and several months ago we started publishing bugs on the Bug Tracker
23:15:44 <skyfaller> https://launchpad.net/web/+bugs
23:15:55 <skyfaller> this is a list of all of the tasks that the web team needs to do
23:15:57 <gavinbaker> another reason Web Team works is because everybody hangs out in IRC :)
23:16:02 <skyfaller> laid out clearly and succinctly
23:16:06 <Christina_> what were the other teams?
23:16:09 <nile> gavinbaker, the key to success
23:16:16 <Fear_of_C> IRC needs to be more advertised, I think
23:16:16 <gavinbaker> is the Webteam list still used?
23:16:17 <skyfaller> and you can track our progress by seeing people open and close bugs
23:16:22 <gavinbaker> Christina_: see http://wiki.freeculture.org/Mailing_lists
23:16:28 * cameronparkins has quit ()
23:16:32 <Fear_of_C> I didn't know about it until skyfaller mentioned it in IM, I think
23:16:39 <Christina_> thank you
23:16:44 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: yes, it is, for stuff that isn't bug reports, like when is our next web team meeting?
23:16:48 <gavinbaker> Christina_: actually, see http://wiki.freeculture.org/Teams
23:16:52 <skyfaller> heh
23:17:06 <skyfaller> yeah, that is another thing that the web team does well
23:17:11 <skyfaller> I think it has some camraderie
23:17:13 <Christina_> yea I found it, staight forward
23:17:21 <skyfaller> because they're all geeks that hang out in this IRC channel and talk to one another
23:17:24 <gavinbaker> irc++
23:17:42 <skyfaller> this may not be the exact way to bring together the other teams, although I think it is definitely a good method
23:17:54 <skyfaller> face-to-face meetings like we proposed earlier today are one method
23:18:12 <skyfaller> conference calls and videoconferences are other possibilities (for people who have that technology / budget)O
23:18:25 <pyrak> we could try to replicate the bug tracker for other teams
23:18:33 <pyrak> like i said, with a craig's list type thing
23:18:38 <skyfaller> but regardless, some camraderie like our IRC channel is good
23:18:38 <gavinbaker> another reason the web team has worked is because it has a leader
23:18:40 <Christina_> i was just going to say conference calls - easy & efficient
23:18:41 <pyrak> like a "job listing" for volunteer work
23:18:48 <gavinbaker> paulproteus has been there to make things happen when nobody else was
23:18:52 <Fear_of_C> teamspeak!
23:18:52 <skyfaller> Christina_: IRC is better in some ways, but that's an argument for another day
23:19:01 <gavinbaker> teams need a leader for stuff to consistently get done
23:19:29 <skyfaller> yeah, Asheesh has done a good job of organizing the labor
23:19:38 <paulproteus> gavinbaker, With all due modesty, I can't underestimate how important I've been....
23:19:38 <skyfaller> and I guess I can pat myself on the back for recruiting people to join the web team
23:19:48 <Christina_> I love this so far, so easy
23:19:49 <paulproteus> During time gaps, that is.
23:19:53 <nile> paulproteus, you're so wonderful!
23:19:54 <nile> 0_0
23:20:02 <nile> =)
23:20:09 <skyfaller> paulproteus = Asheesh
23:20:11 <pyrak> <3
23:20:13 <paulproteus> Now when we have dudes like pyrak appearing as if out of nowhere it's certainly quite some relief!
23:20:27 <gavinbaker> paulproteus is the capitalist that organizes the unwashed masses. that's why he's awesome!
23:20:42 * nile glances at gavinbaker
23:20:44 <skyfaller> yeah, unfortunately our recruiting method was "Nelson personally IMs people" or "people hang out in IRC and hear about web stuff"
23:20:54 <skyfaller> we need to make it more public in the future
23:20:57 <skyfaller> same with other teams
23:21:03 <gavinbaker> ok, so how to do that?
23:21:17 <pyrak> ok, i fear i'm becoming redundant
23:21:17 <skyfaller> (1) have meetings
23:21:32 <skyfaller> publicly announced meetings
23:21:32 <pyrak> but again, "job board"/craigslist setup
23:21:44 <gavinbaker> pyrak: we've heard you -- it'll be in the minutes!
23:21:52 <pyrak> awesome, sorry for redundancy
23:21:52 <skyfaller> so here's where we announce the meeting time!
23:21:56 <skyfaller> heh
23:22:18 <skyfaller> so who wants to volunteer and when are you free? I'd like to propose Weds 10pm EDT, because that's a traditional time that has worked in the past
23:22:29 <skyfaller> but we could also do Sunday afternoon before the Chapters meeting
23:22:32 <gavinbaker> personally, i'm don't think i'll show up at 10pm EDT on a weeknight
23:22:32 <skyfaller> or any other time
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23:22:40 <gavinbaker> i think that'll be the same for others who work on the East Coast
23:22:46 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: well, many people are busy with activities until late at night
23:22:50 <Christina_> I can't either, bad wifi in my apt
23:22:50 * conley steps back in
23:22:54 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: remember it's the summer
23:22:54 <paulproteus> I'm going to go eat dinner now.
23:22:56 <erinR> me either - work
23:23:00 <skyfaller> heh
23:23:09 <skyfaller> well, with a new group of people comes a new time that's good for everyone I guess
23:23:11 <pyrak> paulproteus, bon appetit
23:23:11 <gavinbaker> is the weekend terrible for people? like sunday?
23:23:14 <skyfaller> what about Sunday afternoon?
23:23:27 <skyfaller> I mean, the problem with that time used to be that people had homework due the next day
23:23:35 <gavinbaker> well, not over the summer.
23:23:43 <gavinbaker> we don't have to pick a time that'll last forever, just for a month
23:23:44 <skyfaller> OK, so I guess we're talking about over the summer now
23:23:45 <skyfaller> that's true
23:23:47 <Christina_> I thought tonight's time was good even though i had to be late for this one
23:24:02 <skyfaller> Christina_: I wanted to have the chapter meetings at this time
23:24:02 <erinR> i thought so too
23:24:03 <gavinbaker> hell, if we can have the first volunteer meeting, it's a start, and we can schedule-adjust from there
23:24:03 <Fear_of_C> it's getting late on the east coast over here
23:24:09 <skyfaller> but we could have volunteer meetings before or after
23:24:25 <skyfaller> would people want to arrive an hour early for the chapters meeting, say at 8pm EDT?
23:24:27 <nile> Sunday, 9pm EDT. good for me.
23:24:44 <nile> 8 is okay too
23:24:46 <pyrak> re: meetings one after another, consider overflow, like we're seeing now ;)
23:24:50 <Christina_> 8 is fine
23:24:57 <skyfaller> well, one meeting will have to be viciously cut off
23:25:04 <pyrak> true
23:25:08 <skyfaller> and if we have the volunteers meeting first, that's what will be cut off
23:25:10 <skyfaller> viciously
23:25:13 <skyfaller> and without remorse
23:25:15 <gavinbaker> skyfaller: are we going to have weekly chapters meetings?
23:25:27 <skyfaller> I think we should
23:25:28 <gavinbaker> i mean, what exactly will happen at those meetings?
23:25:38 <skyfaller> they can be short and unofficial if people don't have a lot of business
23:25:44 <skyfaller> but I think it would be good for people to talk to each other
23:25:48 <gavinbaker> what "business" would there be for chapters?
23:25:53 <pyrak> for my money (2cents?) i agree that sunday nights people may be busy stressing about getting a paper done by morning
23:26:03 <pyrak> at least i will be, personally
23:26:06 <Fear_of_C> sunday nights are probably not as good during the school year
23:26:08 <skyfaller> pyrak: but they're even more stressed during the week
23:26:14 <skyfaller> and are too busy partying on Friday and Saturday
23:26:16 <Fear_of_C> they are ok during the summer as long as they do not run too late
23:26:18 <skyfaller> heh
23:26:26 <skyfaller> which is why we used to have them on Weds
23:26:30 <skyfaller> b/c that's the middle of the week
23:26:30 <gavinbaker> look, scheduling is hard. we don't have to find a perfect time now. let's just pick a time for next week!
23:26:31 <Fear_of_C> actually, I think I'm usually less stressed thursday night than sunday
23:26:32 <pyrak> summertime this isn't a concern, true
23:26:37 <skyfaller> and presumably relatively unstressful
23:26:38 <Christina_> sundays are still fine, i start stressing monday mornings
23:26:44 <gavinbaker> let's pick a time for next week. we can pick later times later.
23:26:45 <skyfaller> yeah
23:26:51 <skyfaller> we'll talk about times during the school year another time
23:27:05 <skyfaller> but is Sunday at 8pm EDT fine for everyone over the summer?
23:27:13 <erinR> yes
23:27:13 <Fear_of_C> seems pretty good
23:27:16 <gavinbaker> speak now or forever hold your peace (at least, until next week)
23:27:31 <pyrak> personally, i'm off a week from tomorrow, so may not be able to make it next week
23:27:37 <pyrak> then for the following month :(
23:27:41 <pyrak> but i'll do my best
23:27:41 * CTho has quit (Connection timed out)
23:27:44 <skyfaller> pyrak: that's fine, you're already volunteering with the web team
23:27:50 <Christina_> Yes to 8
23:27:56 <skyfaller> you have a chapter to run, you don't have to be on 5 teams :P
23:28:09 <pyrak> yeah, but my chapter is not so active
23:28:15 <skyfaller> pyrak: then you should work on that!
23:28:23 <pyrak> whipping highschoolers into an activist mentality is extremely difficult
23:28:36 <gavinbaker> pyrak: just tell them they're taking bittorrent away
23:28:37 <skyfaller> we can get other coders, but we can't get other people at your high school unless you personally recruit them
23:28:42 <gavinbaker> (do kids still use bittorrent?)
23:28:47 <Fear_of_C> yeah
23:28:48 <gavinbaker> question, should the web team (or at least a rep) be at the volunteers meeting?
23:29:00 <skyfaller> yeah, a rep should always be at the volunteers meeting I think
23:29:08 <skyfaller> so that if the other volunteers need some web stuff done
23:29:14 <skyfaller> they can ask the web team rep abouut it
23:29:35 <skyfaller> paulproteus: would you be OK with Sunday at 8pm EDT?
23:29:42 <skyfaller> oh, he's eating
23:29:42 <gavinbaker> ok. so anyone who wants to volunteer, bring your pretty faces 'round here at 8pmEDT a week from now
23:29:58 <gavinbaker> uh, hanging out in IRC is also a good way to get involved
23:30:03 <skyfaller> wait
23:30:03 <gavinbaker> not to plug IRC too hard ;)
23:30:07 <skyfaller> we're going to start a mailing list again
23:30:10 <skyfaller> for volunteers
23:30:14 <gavinbaker> is that the same as Core?
23:30:15 <Fear_of_C> stupid question: what time zone is EDT?
23:30:19 <skyfaller> can we call it Core for old time's sake?
23:30:24 <skyfaller> Fear_of_C: Eastern time
23:30:25 <gavinbaker> Fear_of_C: it's 11:30pm in EDT right now
23:30:30 <Fear_of_C> ah, ok, cool
23:30:30 <skyfaller> during daylight savings time
23:30:31 <conley> that is the east
23:30:31 <Fear_of_C> thanks
23:30:47 <skyfaller> So volunteers will organize using the Core list?
23:30:49 <gavinbaker> see www.timeanddate.com for all your reference needs
23:30:53 <skyfaller> core@freeculture.org ?
23:30:57 <skyfaller> is that fine with people?
23:31:16 * e (i=ab40f482@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-c15705dae3aef3c8) has joined #freeculture
23:31:17 <poningru> sure
23:31:19 <skyfaller> heh, I guess so
23:31:21 <Christina_> yes
23:31:23 <skyfaller> ok
23:31:25 <poningru> e?
23:31:28 <skyfaller> who wants to be subscribed to Core
23:31:31 <gavinbaker> is this how we used to use core?
23:31:32 <poningru> erin?
23:31:36 <Christina_> me
23:31:40 <skyfaller> give me your e-mail addresses
23:31:40 <Fear_of_C> me too
23:31:41 <poningru> k
23:31:44 <gavinbaker> and who will decide who gets subscribed to core?
23:31:47 <Fear_of_C> nlaracu1@swarthmore.edu
23:31:49 * pyrak raises hand
23:31:50 <nile> skyfaller, it's fine!
23:31:50 <poningru> poningru@ufl.edu
23:32:03 <pyrak> gameguy43@gmail.com
23:32:05 <nile> skyfaller, I want to!
23:32:09 <gavinbaker> should we just put out the call on chapters list? and have people forward it to their chapters?
23:32:11 <skyfaller> nile: e-mail address
23:32:16 <nile> nile @ deadbox.ath.cx
23:32:17 <skyfaller> gavinbaker: yeah, we'll put out a call on the Chapters list
23:32:21 <e> my browser keeps closing
23:32:29 <skyfaller> and anyone can join if they're interested in volunteering
23:32:31 <gavinbaker> p.s. why can't we call it volunteers@freeculture.org? (or, better, volunteers@lists.freeculture.org ?)
23:32:38 <nile> silly firefox.
23:32:43 <skyfaller> e: you should get a real IRC client, sorry that the web portal isn't working for you
23:32:51 <skyfaller> e: I can help you with that after the meeting
23:32:57 <gavinbaker> s/firefox/iceweasel | no trademark violations in here!
23:32:58 <BrianRowe> Later, see you next week.
23:33:14 <nile> bye bye BrianRowe
23:33:14 * poningru beats up gavinbaker
23:33:16 <gavinbaker> bye BrianRowe ! more happy-fun-time next week!
23:33:21 <skyfaller> ... I can change it to volunteers
23:33:21 * BrianRowe (n=Brion@71-35-169-59.tukw.qwest.net) has left #freeculture
23:33:26 <skyfaller> I don't really care
23:33:33 <poningru> hey guys lets keep this meeting going
23:33:38 <skyfaller> Core just gives me warm fuzzies, but don't listen to the nostalgic fogey
23:33:39 <poningru> only half an hour to make it 3 hours
23:33:40 <Christina_> cducruet@gmail.com
23:33:42 <gavinbaker> poningru, it's done once we decide this
23:33:46 <nile> volunteers is probably a bit more obvious than core, but I really don't care.
23:33:54 <skyfaller> ok, fine Volunteers it is
23:33:59 <poningru> waah
23:33:59 <pyrak> ++
23:34:01 <skyfaller> in with the new
23:34:03 <skyfaller> out with the old
23:34:12 <hj_> Who has the minute ?
23:34:13 <nile> volunt33rs
23:34:15 <gavinbaker> i thought the Core Team was the predecessor to Board... well, it was both... for decision-making and for doing-stuff
23:34:21 <nile> hj_, gavinbaker (supposedly)
23:34:30 <gavinbaker> hj_: yes, i'll send them to the chapters list. are you on that list?
23:34:31 <skyfaller> Core was everyone who volunteered with FC.o
23:34:41 <skyfaller> FC.o back then was a "work-o-cracy"
23:34:43 * poningru pastes log
23:34:52 <skyfaller> where we decided things by consensus among the people who volunteered nationally
23:34:52 <poningru> we still are
23:34:52 * nile isn't on the chapters list =(
23:35:07 <nile> skyfaller, can you add me to that?
23:35:17 <skyfaller> nile: sure, I'll go do that
23:35:20 <gavinbaker> ok, is everybody on the chapters list? tell me now (preferably in PM, if you know how) if you aren't
23:35:44 <pyrak> meeting closed?
23:35:54 <nile> (type /msg gavinbaker hi gavin, this is a private message)
23:35:57 <skyfaller> nile: nile@deadbox.ath.cx is subscribed to the Chapters list
23:36:00 <pyrak> other orders of business
23:36:04 <gavinbaker> Christina_, erinR, pyrak, hj_: you're on the chapters@freeculture.org mailing list?
23:36:05 * nile cheers
23:36:13 <skyfaller> nile: no, it was subscribed already
23:36:21 <gavinbaker> pyrak: this is the last order of business for the night
23:36:23 <skyfaller> nile: so you should investigate why you didn't get the last e-maill
23:36:28 <Christina_> I think I am?
23:36:31 <gavinbaker> pyrak: what, this meeting wasn't long enough for you?
23:36:38 <pyrak> gavinbaker, hm, i think i'm only on discuss, add me: gameguy43@gmail.com
23:36:42 <gavinbaker> Christina_: check if you just got some messages from me to that list
23:36:49 <Christina_> ok
23:36:57 <gavinbaker> (in the future we'll have a more organized way of making sure people get on the chapters list)
23:37:10 <gavinbaker> (in the future, time travel will be safe!)
23:37:15 <Christina_> I am on it, I thought so thanks
23:37:28 <skyfaller> pyrak: gameguy43@gmail.com is already subscribed too
23:37:35 <skyfaller> why the fuck aren't our e-mails getting to people?
23:37:39 <skyfaller> WTF
23:37:41 <nile> skyfaller, oh. what the hell.
23:37:49 <gavinbaker> are we being greylisted? spam-filtered? deleting them before you read them? ...
23:37:54 * ryanfaerman (n=ryanfaer@crlspr-69.65.71.237.myacc.net) has joined #freeculture
23:38:19 <skyfaller> I hate e-mail, just for the record
23:38:33 <gavinbaker> p.s. if you're on the chapters list, you can post to it, too! yay for r/w culture :D
23:38:52 <pyrak> ok, i found an email from fc-chapters, so i think i'm good
23:39:05 <skyfaller> ok
23:39:08 <nile> nevermind. I am on it.
23:39:12 * nile gets gavin's mail
23:39:16 <skyfaller> pyrak, nile: pay attention next time :P
23:39:28 <gavinbaker> nile: unlike some blackholes we know
23:39:41 <skyfaller> OK, well, that's it
23:39:52 <gavinbaker> um. so i'll start a wiki page for next week's volunteer meeting
23:40:01 <skyfaller> we'll be announcing through various venues that we're having a volunteers meeting next week
23:40:05 <skyfaller> and another chapters meeting
23:40:07 <gavinbaker> it'll be 2007-07-(15+7)
23:40:14 <gavinbaker> er, that's 2007-07-22
23:40:19 <skyfaller> good math, Gavin
23:40:25 <gavinbaker> if you have something you want to talk about, add it to that page
23:40:28 <pyrak> i wanna throw out a crazy idea for a "project" that i came up with the other day
23:40:36 <gavinbaker> pyrak: put it on the wiki :)
23:40:44 <skyfaller> pyrak: bring it up at the volunteers meeting
23:40:46 <gavinbaker> and once we get the list set up, we can discuss it on the volunteers list
23:40:49 <skyfaller> put it on the agenda beforehand
23:40:53 <nile> skyfaller, I guess I just assumed the announcement email was sent to fc-discuss
23:40:58 <pyrak> ok
23:41:10 <skyfaller> nile: no, nobody on FC-discuss is actually in a chapter :P
23:41:27 <nile> right, makes sense.
23:41:29 * nile dances
23:41:35 <nile> yay meeting over!
23:41:36 <skyfaller> alright, this meeting is finally over
23:41:40 <gavinbaker> so any projects or working ideas, bring them to the volunteers meeting (post them on the wiki beforehand)
23:41:42 <skyfaller> let's all go home and get drunk or something
23:41:47 <gavinbaker> read over the bylaws and comment on them!
23:41:48 <nile> gavinbaker, seriously. blackholes for the lose
23:41:54 <skyfaller> for the record, not all meetings are this long
23:42:00 <skyfaller> this is just the first meeting we've had in months
23:42:07 <nile> skyfaller, I'm straightedge, you insensitive clod!
23:42:13 <skyfaller> so stuff has piled up
23:42:23 <skyfaller> nile: gavin says you're lying ;-)
23:42:42 <skyfaller> e, pyrak, conley.... you needed webspace help?
23:42:48 <skyfaller> Fear_of_C?
23:42:49 <conley> sure
23:43:05 <skyfaller> I guess who has to go to bed first?
23:43:15 <skyfaller> to each according to his need!
23:43:22 * skyfaller establishes webspace marxism
23:43:29 * gavinbaker has changed the topic to: FreeCulture.org | student movement for free culture | http://freeculture.org/ | Bug tracker: https://launchpad.net/web/+bugs | New Web site just launched, check it out! | Minutes from last Chapters meeting at: http://wiki.freeculture.org/2007-07-15| Volunteer meeting Sunday, 2 July at 8 pm EDT
23:43:51 <Christina_> ok
23:43:54 <Christina_> night night
23:44:03 <pyrak> skyfaller, i think i already filed bugs for the stuff i needed
23:44:05 <skyfaller> Christina_: thanks for coming!
23:44:08 <pyrak> so you can get to it whenever
23:44:10 <gavinbaker> bye Christina_ !
23:44:20 <gavinbaker> poningru: will you dump the log on the wiki and link me when you have?
23:44:22 <Christina_> glad I got to be here for a little bit!
23:44:30 <Christina_> see you at the volunteer mtg i guess
23:44:33 <Christina_> bye
23:44:50 <skyfaller> Christina_: thanks for coming!
23:44:52 * Christina_ has quit ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007051502]")